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by Scrupulous » Sun Sep 02, 2007 3:35 pm
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Scrupulous - Black Belt
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Work2XL wrote: ...I do have one question. If in a "Super Secret" forum you disclose a project, would that be considered "Public disclosure" by any foreign countries for patent purposes?
My hunch is no, but I wouldn't want to bet the farm on one of my hunches.
Randy
Randy, the way your question is worded, the answer is no. It wouldn't be a public disclosure, in and of itself. Of course the risk is, should someone else from the group go off and publicize it on their own, either intentionally or accidentally, then it may amount to a bar of international rights.
But, that's one of the things that makes America the beautiful. Even a purposely malicious leak would not bar you from US patent rights, not for an entire year. This will probably remain true, even if the US goes to a first-to-file system.
So, if domestic commerce is enough for you to get in, make your money, and get out, then there is a tremendous advantage to developing your ideas in a "think tank". As a seasoned operations guy, I bet you already know this. And, let's face it, foreign patents may not prevent knockoffs.
(Now, as a design engineer and project manager, I've worked with some pretty bright people, for some respected technical corporations. But, I'm literally chomping at the bit to develop projects with some of the people on this forum.)
by Scrupulous » Sun Sep 02, 2007 4:02 pm
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Scrupulous - Black Belt
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Good thoughts, Michelle.
The whole point of a private forum would be to operate under the ideal assumption that everything will be kept confidential. What it boils down to is that there is really no way to guarantee that, not even for meetings in person. But, that isn't reason enough not to do this. A basic agreement with an indemnity clause would be fine.
The first challenge for a web-based community is that we don't even have everyone's real names yet. I wouldn't want to force anyone to be anything but anonymous. But realistically, that might be one of the most sensible requirements to consider. Then, all these viable approaches, using NDA's and a structured hierarchy for the forums would actually carry some legitimacy.
I like your suggestion to just email a statement of confidentiality. Take that one step further and consider a form statement that could be simply posted and agreed-to by any member, prior to joining the private section. Either way, the statement should be made available to the existing members.
That means those statements or emails should be posted in some other forum, so that they can be acknowledged and access can be granted. Some kind of folder that only the group members have access to, would also work.
I think the solution, in one form or another, has already be presented among these discussions. It's just a matter of choosing one that the webmaster is able to reasonably incorporate.
With this thread, I'm just trying to get people to start thinking in terms of cooperation, because that will be a necessity no matter what.
The whole point of a private forum would be to operate under the ideal assumption that everything will be kept confidential. What it boils down to is that there is really no way to guarantee that, not even for meetings in person. But, that isn't reason enough not to do this. A basic agreement with an indemnity clause would be fine.
The first challenge for a web-based community is that we don't even have everyone's real names yet. I wouldn't want to force anyone to be anything but anonymous. But realistically, that might be one of the most sensible requirements to consider. Then, all these viable approaches, using NDA's and a structured hierarchy for the forums would actually carry some legitimacy.
I like your suggestion to just email a statement of confidentiality. Take that one step further and consider a form statement that could be simply posted and agreed-to by any member, prior to joining the private section. Either way, the statement should be made available to the existing members.
That means those statements or emails should be posted in some other forum, so that they can be acknowledged and access can be granted. Some kind of folder that only the group members have access to, would also work.
I think the solution, in one form or another, has already be presented among these discussions. It's just a matter of choosing one that the webmaster is able to reasonably incorporate.
With this thread, I'm just trying to get people to start thinking in terms of cooperation, because that will be a necessity no matter what.
by Michelle » Sun Sep 02, 2007 4:10 pm
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Michelle - Black Belt
- Posts: 1529
- Joined: Wed Oct 11, 2006 7:27 am
I will ask webmaster at next Management Meeting what we can do to keep a file.
For the lower standard of privacy:
It may just be as simple as to join, you need to send by email a copy of contract electronically signed, mailed to you and to me with real identity.
You keep master list of people and update it as needed in the private forums (with real name kept private by us)
Forum intro and documents clear that it's only just limited access...may not be legal protection. Ispot released.
For further levels, the Ispot Think Tank can decide?
For the lower standard of privacy:
It may just be as simple as to join, you need to send by email a copy of contract electronically signed, mailed to you and to me with real identity.
You keep master list of people and update it as needed in the private forums (with real name kept private by us)
Forum intro and documents clear that it's only just limited access...may not be legal protection. Ispot released.
For further levels, the Ispot Think Tank can decide?
by mojo62 » Sun Sep 02, 2007 5:23 pm
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mojo62 - Black Belt
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- Location: Texas
Scrup,
From the activity I witnessed in the other "think tank" threads, I
think you should just pick yourself a small 2 or 3 man team from here and go for the first project.
I think you should use your good judgement and pick who you think you could accomplish this first project with.
I think that would maybe be the best way to start the 'think tank".
Then it could fan out from there.
Regards,
MO
From the activity I witnessed in the other "think tank" threads, I
think you should just pick yourself a small 2 or 3 man team from here and go for the first project.
I think you should use your good judgement and pick who you think you could accomplish this first project with.
I think that would maybe be the best way to start the 'think tank".
Then it could fan out from there.
Regards,
MO
by Scrupulous » Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:34 pm
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Scrupulous - Black Belt
- Posts: 2414
- Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: United States
Michelle wrote:I will ask webmaster at next Management Meeting what we can do to keep a file.
For the lower standard of privacy:
It may just be as simple as to join, you need to send by email a copy of contract electronically signed, mailed to you and to me with real identity.
You keep master list of people and update it as needed in the private forums (with real name kept private by us)
Forum intro and documents clear that it's only just limited access...may not be legal protection. Ispot released.
For further levels, the Ispot Think Tank can decide?
That sounds very nice, Michelle. It's bordering on perfection.
by Scrupulous » Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:55 pm
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Scrupulous - Black Belt
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- Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: United States
mojo62 wrote:Scrup,
From the activity I witnessed in the other "think tank" threads, I
think you should just pick yourself a small 2 or 3 man team from here and go for the first project.
I think you should use your good judgement and pick who you think you could accomplish this first project with.
I think that would maybe be the best way to start the 'think tank".
Then it could fan out from there.
Regards,
MO
Mojo, if it comes to that I will do it, just to prove out the process. Though my preference is to involve 5 to 15 people, for at least a couple reasons...
1) I don't necessarily want to come off sounding like I should be the one to choose people.
2) I would love to see at least one representative from each of the whole handful of processes required to take a project from concept to shelf. That includes at least the following areas:
-creative ideation
-market feasibility
-IP concerns
-product R&D (i.e. solid modeling, graphic design, engineering, etc.)
-tooling
-production
-advertising, branding, UPC's, etc.
-licensing
-sales
You get the idea. Sure, this could be handled by two or three very capable individuals. But, the more people who get involved from the beginning, the more steam we build in the process. You and I both know there are probably plenty of people here who would be able to contribute. And there would be plenty of money to go around.
by Scrupulous » Sun Sep 02, 2007 9:58 pm
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Scrupulous - Black Belt
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- Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:32 pm
- Location: United States
Michelle wrote:Hey, you up to do the first draft of the short agreement?
Yeah. Let me take a good look a the Terms of Service here, and go from there.
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