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Re: LegalZoom
by StephenKey » Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:19 pm
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StephenKey - Blue Belt
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I use patent wizard , great software, easy to use extremely affordable. If your budget allows use a patent attorney or patent agent.
Award Winning Inventor Stephen Key - http://www.inventright.com
Stephen's new book "One Simple Idea" from McGraw-Hill is available in stores nationwide as well as online.
Stephen's new book "One Simple Idea" from McGraw-Hill is available in stores nationwide as well as online.
Re: 24HRPATENT.COM
by dsm6678 » Thu Jul 16, 2009 1:39 am
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Look at 24 hour patent company at the Better Business Bureau at http://www.dc.bbb.org/report.html?national=y&compid=181250733 they just received another complaint and now have an F rating. If you do not trust the link go to the BBB website and use the "Phone, URL, Email" search and type in "24hrpatent.com"
After reading some of the posts and noticing "someone", I have suspicions that the person that runs 24hrpatent.com or a person closley affiliated with 24hrpatent.com is posting messeges here on this very website. Mr. "Steve" or Mr. "Michael" 'who are probably the same person' is not so smart after all.
I need say nothing else on this matter since The Better Business Bureau rating of F says it all.
After reading some of the posts and noticing "someone", I have suspicions that the person that runs 24hrpatent.com or a person closley affiliated with 24hrpatent.com is posting messeges here on this very website. Mr. "Steve" or Mr. "Michael" 'who are probably the same person' is not so smart after all.
I need say nothing else on this matter since The Better Business Bureau rating of F says it all.
Re: 24HRPATENT.COM
by CriterionD » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:33 am
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CriterionD - Blue Belt
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dsm6678 wrote:Look at 24 hour patent company at the Better Business Bureau at http://www.dc.bbb.org/report.html?national=y&compid=181250733 they just received another complaint and now have an F rating. If you do not trust the link go to the BBB website and use the "Phone, URL, Email" search and type in "24hrpatent.com"
After reading some of the posts and noticing "someone", I have suspicions that the person that runs 24hrpatent.com or a person closley affiliated with 24hrpatent.com is posting messeges here on this very website. Mr. "Steve" or Mr. "Michael" 'who are probably the same person' is not so smart after all.
I need say nothing else on this matter since The Better Business Bureau rating of F says it all.
Hmm? According to the link you posted 24hrpatent has not been registered with the Better Business Bureau, which means any complaints would result in an F. There are two complaints against it both of which sound extremely minor.
That said, there are a ton of similar firms out there you do not care to deal with that play on misconceptions regarding patents and in particular, provisional patent applications. Among other shady excepts from 24hrpatent.com:
Is my idea information safe with you?
Yes. It is a federal offense for us to benefit from your invention idea in any way. This company was created to elliminate idea theft by filing applications in 24 hours, faster than any patent firm in the US. Simply put, we file your application within 24 hours for your safety and ours. If someone steals your idea, the chances of them filing a patent between the moment you give your idea to us and the time we file is extremely slim.
However, if you would like to receive a signed Non Disclosure Agreement before you begin with us, just ask and we will email it right over."
It is no federal offense by any means, unless they are in some obscure foreign country, which they might be because their website doesn't specify. If they are in the US, I guess attorney/client privilege may apply if they are a law firm, but there is debate to what attorney/client privilege protects and it does not even appear from this website that this is a law firm.
Further, while it is very rare that someone loses out on patent protection because someone filed a patent on a similar invention a week or two earlier, it is very common for inventors to lose patent rights because they filed a hastily prepared provisional application.
What is the next step after I receive patent pending?
You should immediately begin your marketing process. Once you have patent pending, you should not waste any time showing and discussing your invention with buyers, manufacturers and retailers.
Hmmph? Probably just a typo. But, its worth noting that you don't "receive" patent pending, you "become" patent pending as soon as you submit an application.
Do I need a prototype or engineered drawings?
No. Those are not required on your provisional patent filing
You never need a prototype, however the requirement for patent drawings for a provisional app are none different whatsoever than the requirement for patent drawings when dealing with a non-provisional app. The only difference is a provisional patent application is never examined by the USPTO.
Why is the Provisional Patent application so important?
The provisional filing demonstrates the date of conception and foundation for your full application filed in the future.
The provisional filing must meet the same "enabling disclosure" requirements that any patent application must meet, which again, often require drawings. Otherwise, it does nothing at all to demonstrate a date of conception.
It has been written that nearly 90% of all successful products produced were never sold by the original inventor because he delayed filing for his patent. Instead, someone else thinks of the idea later, files the application and enjoys the benefits of the product.
Typical bs rhetoric...
Even the US Government was aware of the overwhelming invention theft. In 1995 the US Patent office created a new type of patent application to assist early stage inventors in the daunting task of protection.
Umm, no. The provisional application was introduced to allow US inventors and companies to be on equal footing with foreign applicants who could claim priority to a previous foreign application. It was actually not intended to assist cash strapped inventors.
The Provisional is a powerful and effective tool in the inventing process, although most inventors and many attorneys still know nothing about it.
Yes, lol. Have you ever heard an inventor or attorney ever mention the word "provisional"?
Furthermore, if you plan on distributing your product through any major retail chain, store or distribution channel, a patent or patent pending is required by every major buyer.
Percentage wise most products sold by major retailers are not patented. Plus, if the average inventor were to tell a retail buyer their invention was patent pending as they had filed a provisional - most retail buyers would know that that most likely meant nothing.
Re: LegalZoom
by TritonInventor » Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:40 pm
- TritonInventor
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I have filed a couple applications using [DECEPTIVE TRADE NAME], here is a link: [IMPLIES CONNECTION TO GOVERNMENT AGENCY] And unlike LegalZoom where they just use your words and file the application "as is", it is run by patent attorneys and they do everything for you and produce a professionally written application and formal drawings. Customer service is top notch and if you call, you are always talking to a patent attorney. To me that is huge.
And their fees are very reasonable when you consider what LegalZoom charges you and basically get nothing for it.
Bill
And their fees are very reasonable when you consider what LegalZoom charges you and basically get nothing for it.
Bill
Re: 24hrpatent.com
by gigglesmack » Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:08 pm
- gigglesmack
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Hello all!
All I can tell ya is my experience with 24hr patent... Not good. My patent lost it's provisional coverage while I waited 3 months, constantly contacting them, to assist me with a PCT. So, basically, it was unprotected during that time and the provisional filing date could no longer be used internationally as the original filing date. Over and over, I was told that someone would get back to me soon, and that their international attorney had recently relocated and was very busy. Well, 3 months busy?
Then, with my U.S. filing, it came back with NUMEROUS corrections needing to be made. The USPTO made a comment in the paperwork stating that the applicant apparently was unfamiliar with patent applications and that it's a liability not to use a proper attorney, etc. Apparently, it was filed under my name, so the USPTO didn't know that 24hr put it together. I had created the drawings, and 24hr asked me to write one section, but they wrote the rest and reviewed my entries as fully valid. Overall, it doesn't look nearly as thorough or professionally written as other patents I pull up. I paid the full price, although they had me do half the work. I also noticed that part of what they wrote was copied and pasted from someone else's patent... Which, seems strange and shows even moreso that they just slapped it all together.
I had the uspto response and my original filing information reviewed by a local patent attorney and he said the whole thing needed to be reformatted and was a bit of work.
And 24hr's customer service is attrocious! Why they bother to keep that signature line of: "Don't be surprised by our quick response, day or night..." is hilariously untrue.
In theory, sounds like a good deal to get such a great price for patent filing, but the immense hassle and weak protection of the patent written, makes it not even remotely worth it.
All I can tell ya is my experience with 24hr patent... Not good. My patent lost it's provisional coverage while I waited 3 months, constantly contacting them, to assist me with a PCT. So, basically, it was unprotected during that time and the provisional filing date could no longer be used internationally as the original filing date. Over and over, I was told that someone would get back to me soon, and that their international attorney had recently relocated and was very busy. Well, 3 months busy?
Then, with my U.S. filing, it came back with NUMEROUS corrections needing to be made. The USPTO made a comment in the paperwork stating that the applicant apparently was unfamiliar with patent applications and that it's a liability not to use a proper attorney, etc. Apparently, it was filed under my name, so the USPTO didn't know that 24hr put it together. I had created the drawings, and 24hr asked me to write one section, but they wrote the rest and reviewed my entries as fully valid. Overall, it doesn't look nearly as thorough or professionally written as other patents I pull up. I paid the full price, although they had me do half the work. I also noticed that part of what they wrote was copied and pasted from someone else's patent... Which, seems strange and shows even moreso that they just slapped it all together.
I had the uspto response and my original filing information reviewed by a local patent attorney and he said the whole thing needed to be reformatted and was a bit of work.
And 24hr's customer service is attrocious! Why they bother to keep that signature line of: "Don't be surprised by our quick response, day or night..." is hilariously untrue.
In theory, sounds like a good deal to get such a great price for patent filing, but the immense hassle and weak protection of the patent written, makes it not even remotely worth it.
Re: LegalZoom
by CriterionD » Fri Sep 04, 2009 11:26 am
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CriterionD - Blue Belt
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- Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 6:23 pm
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All I can tell ya is my experience with 24hr patent... Not good. My patent lost it's provisional coverage while I waited 3 months, constantly contacting them, to assist me with a PCT. So, basically, it was unprotected during that time and the provisional filing date could no longer be used internationally as the original filing date. Over and over, I was told that someone would get back to me soon, and that their international attorney had recently relocated and was very busy. Well, 3 months busy?
For what its worth, chances are your provisional application wouldn't have held up to scrutiny anyways (for the same or similar reasons your non-provisional app didn't), in which case it would not have served as a filing date for any domestic or foreign application. If it did initially, it wouldn't do so in court.
In theory, sounds like a good deal to get such a great price for patent filing
Since the internet became popular, it has unfortunately been common for companies to take advantage of such theory. LegalZoom - the subject of this thread - is in the same category although they are at least a bit more professional than a 24hourpatent.com (and don't deal with non-provisional applications).
Re: LegalZoom
by PatentCounsel » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:35 am
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Wow, this is an interesting thread!
My advice is pretty simple: you get what you pay for.
As an aside, I find it amazingly troubling that any patent attorney or agent would file a provisional in mere minutes without stomping up & down clarifying to the client that the result would quite likely be a worthless filing. In my expert opinion (as of 9/2009), if you're paying less than $1,000US for a provisional patent application, there's a very good chance that you are wasting your time and money.
My advice is pretty simple: you get what you pay for.
As an aside, I find it amazingly troubling that any patent attorney or agent would file a provisional in mere minutes without stomping up & down clarifying to the client that the result would quite likely be a worthless filing. In my expert opinion (as of 9/2009), if you're paying less than $1,000US for a provisional patent application, there's a very good chance that you are wasting your time and money.
Re: LegalZoom
by MPANTS » Mon May 24, 2010 1:10 pm
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24hrpatent.com--- SCAM SCAM SCAM.
Seriously, I called before I started the process to hash out my concerns regarding their terrible BBB reviews, as well as their terrible reviews on here. "Steve" or 'Ian" (who by the way is pretty much the only person that ever answers the phone), told me that it was their competition as this is such a "competitive industry." I foolishly bought his BS, he's a pretty good salesguy. I paid my money for a utility patent and 30 days later still heard nothing despite repeated attempts at emailing, calling etc. I finally get someone working on my case who does such a half cocked job and was cutting it to the wire of my application date (despite the fact that I told them multiple times that I didn't want this to be a last minute dash to file) that I end up just buying a book and doing it myself. I call to excessively complain for my refund and no surprise, they are of course unresponsive and impossible to get ahold of. My advice, run far far away! This is a scam job 100%. These people are crooks and should be shut down. Don't be fooled if they answer once or twice, this company will cost you more in wasting your time and energy trying to get a hold of them than they ever will writing you a crappy patent that won't do anything for you anyway.
Seriously, I called before I started the process to hash out my concerns regarding their terrible BBB reviews, as well as their terrible reviews on here. "Steve" or 'Ian" (who by the way is pretty much the only person that ever answers the phone), told me that it was their competition as this is such a "competitive industry." I foolishly bought his BS, he's a pretty good salesguy. I paid my money for a utility patent and 30 days later still heard nothing despite repeated attempts at emailing, calling etc. I finally get someone working on my case who does such a half cocked job and was cutting it to the wire of my application date (despite the fact that I told them multiple times that I didn't want this to be a last minute dash to file) that I end up just buying a book and doing it myself. I call to excessively complain for my refund and no surprise, they are of course unresponsive and impossible to get ahold of. My advice, run far far away! This is a scam job 100%. These people are crooks and should be shut down. Don't be fooled if they answer once or twice, this company will cost you more in wasting your time and energy trying to get a hold of them than they ever will writing you a crappy patent that won't do anything for you anyway.
Re: LegalZoom
by apapage » Tue May 25, 2010 8:40 pm
- apapage
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- Location: NYC
"As an aside, I find it amazingly troubling that any patent attorney or agent would file a provisional in mere minutes without stomping up & down clarifying to the client that the result would quite likely be a worthless filing. In my expert opinion (as of 9/2009), if you're paying less than $1,000US for a provisional patent application, there's a very good chance that you are wasting your time and money."
I wouldn't go that far. It does take some time to fully describe an invention, but for really simple inventions a seasoned practitioner should be able to work within those limitations providing of course that the inventor provides a good description of the invention and at least the informal drawings to go along with the filing. Is this the best scenario? Probably not, but this is a business decision that inventors must make given their budget and expectations.
I wouldn't go that far. It does take some time to fully describe an invention, but for really simple inventions a seasoned practitioner should be able to work within those limitations providing of course that the inventor provides a good description of the invention and at least the informal drawings to go along with the filing. Is this the best scenario? Probably not, but this is a business decision that inventors must make given their budget and expectations.
A Papageorgiou
http://www.patentlawforinventors.com
http://www.patentlawforinventors.com
Re: LegalZoom
by bizgirl » Sun Jun 20, 2010 9:33 am
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I tried 24HrPatent.com. Initially, everything appeared to go smoothly. I filed several provisional patents and received confirmations for these submissions almost immediately by email.
However, I did not receive a paper confirmation from teh US Patent Office for several months. And when I did receive the confirmation from teh USPTO, the letter stated that no filing fees were received, even though I had successfully submitted my credit card and received confirmation of this payment online.
I immediately tried to contact 24HrPatent online to ask them what happened. I received no response from the firm whatsoever. I am now trying to write them a complaint letter, but 24HrPatent has no listed physical address.
However, I did not receive a paper confirmation from teh US Patent Office for several months. And when I did receive the confirmation from teh USPTO, the letter stated that no filing fees were received, even though I had successfully submitted my credit card and received confirmation of this payment online.
I immediately tried to contact 24HrPatent online to ask them what happened. I received no response from the firm whatsoever. I am now trying to write them a complaint letter, but 24HrPatent has no listed physical address.
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